Question on M6

[Vicki_in_Florida]

For those who went overseas and already received the M6,
Are you receiving after care from a doctor here in the US?

My hubby is leaning towards going to England or Barcelona.
Have a few questions.

Did you talk to both of the above places?
What swayed you to choose one over the other?
Did they help you with lodging?
How long did you stay?
How did you handle the flight home to US?
Did you see if a US doctor would care for you on your return BEFORE you had the procedure?
What is the best way to contact them? (email or phone)
What phone did you call and can you recommend a person to speak with that you liked?
If there is anything you'd like to share with me, you can also send me a private message.

Thanks

[Hooch]

The only medical care I am recieving is through a GP (or primary care doc over there) and physio.

Once the disc goes in or they fuse the spine and they keep an eye on you for a few days post op it is very unlikely there will be any cause to go back in. So in that regard it doesn't really matter what they do post-op, the deed is done, all that matters is they do a good job during the op. That reality allowed me to consider going overseas. My operating surgeon looked at scans at 3 and 6 months post op.

When I went through Boeree there was a clause that any complications due to the op that required readmission to the hospital would not be charged... I imagine after a few complications that clause may be changed, but it is probably still there.

My back is doing very well. The Potters Heron inn is as cheap as the rest and quite nice. They can sort out a driver for you to the airport. I got into contact with them through their website.

I'm sure it will all work out, if you go through someone overseas or Zigler. I suppose now you know they arent sent from God, just men and women like us. Good luck.

Chris.

[laid up doc]

we physicians are but mortals, don't ever forget! we are subject to what the people out front say to our patients, to what the nurses say, what the narc addicted borderline lady w/ a med list longer than her arm says.... you get the idea. we have to go in the room after that and establish the best pt-doc relationship we can, and help patients make the best decisions for THEM.

ideally, you set up your practice w/ good front line folks. my situation is different since i'm an ER doc, but in that regard i have to deal w/ it every.single.day.

do what you feel comfortable with... has Zigler even attempted to reach you? i had a huuuuge problem getting in touch w/ my pain dr, which necessitated me texting him when i needed something. for a while i thought it was b/c he didn't care, but then i remembered who the garden variety pt going through his door was, and understood why there were such barriers.

[Vicki_in_Florida]

I asked if Dr Zigler could give us a call.
I was told he "doesn't do phone consulting".
I spent airline fare for two, rental car, hotel, food, and a $500 office visit charge. I had previously sent all records and mri's.
When I seen him, all he did was say yes, you are a prime candidate for an adr. (knew that already)
It takes about 90 minutes to do. You stay in the hospital for 24 hours, etc. Once we got home, we thought of a few more questions. We were not allowed to speak to him.
I spent a lot of money to go there. They waited till 30 minutes before flight to renege on the payment arrangement. The doctors $19,000 was already paid in full.

He couldn't call me?
They except A LOT less from people whose insurance actually paid for any of this. I can't go back to him.
He couldn't care less about me. He can take his big name, big ego and stick it somewhere less sunny!

I'm so tired of being treated badly.
The doctor here in Florida that a member here suggested wanted a credit card (a three thousand dollar temp charge BEFORE they would give me an appt) and the first visit will be up to $800! I already had bone density done, blood work, and EKG done. Already have MRI. I'm spending thousands just to find the right doctor.

This is absurb. I have insurance. Back rider on it
Does that mean screw me the whole rest of my life?

I'm only 48 years old. I've been going through this for ten years now. I can hardly wait to get old. It really makes me sad for our seniors and people with no money for insurance or care.

I'm trying not to fall into depression, but it's getting hard not to.
I never understood how my eldest brother could have killed himself when he was 26. He was depressed because he had stomach cancer. I was 15 when he did that. Now that I'm older and wiser, I understand his depression. I'm not saying I agree with what he did but I can understand it. Sometimes, this world just blows! Is it all about $$$? Doesn't anyone just care about their fellow man? I just feel like I'm deserted on an no insurance, screw off if you can't pay cash island.

[annapurna]

Laura went with Prodic and Charite but did go overseas to get them so I can offer some advice on that. If you have any frequent flyer miles or status you can occasionally get lucky and end up in a first class or business class seat for the over the water leg. We did it each time and never regretted it. It was definitely necessary for Laura's lumbar ADR.

If you can't do that, you can look at ground transport across Europe as the trains are good and first class seats aren't that much on a train. That could cut the flight time to what you need across the water only. Having done it myself, Orlando to Atlanta to Munich isn't fun but isn't horrible. Make sure your connections are wide open on the return. You might be up to running for the plane but probably will not.

[mcjagger]

I just had a telephone consult with Mr. Boeree this past Saturday and I must say that it was very productive. After contacting him via his website I simply created a zip file of all my mri's, xrays and reports, uploaded them to google docs for him to see. He then phoned me at an pre arranged time and spent 30-45 minutes talking about my case and options. There was an upfront fee but I feel it was well worth it. Just some food for thought, hope it helps, and hang in there!!!!

[Jstuckey]

My experience the same as mcjagger above. Even if you're not considering the overseas trip, it is a very productive consultation - more productive and involved than any I've ever had face to face.

[Vicki_in_Florida]

I wanted to add to this thread that Dr. Zigler did call me today.
I emailed him as to what happened before I was to leave for TBI.
He had no idea and felt really bad. We talked for 45 minutes.
The CEO is contacting me tomorrow to make sure that their staff doesn't treat anyone else the way I was treated.

I was very touched that he personally called me, on his day off too.

[jss]

Vicki,

Per your questions...

- I talked to five overseas surgeons, but Dr Boeree was not one of them.
- I chose Clavel because of ADR experience (practical and research), lack of horror stories (like the Germans have), and cost
- I arranged all of my own lodging and travel
- I was in the hospital two nights, and in Barcelona a further five days
- My return flight was easy and painless; but my surgery was cervical, yours is lumbar which has a MUCH more difficult recovery
- I did NOT make arrangements for a local post-surgical checkup before leaving. And it was a chore to finally find a local ADR doctor that would give me a simple checkup.
- I emailed initially and had phone conversations later
- For some reason Dr Clavel has a high rate of turnover in his office personnel. I always spoke with Doutsen, who was replaced with Christina, who is now also gone.

I read of your problem at TBI ... condolences. It seems that Dr Zigler's phone call may have ya'll reconsidering using TBI again? Dr Clavel is by all accounts an outstanding ADR surgeon, and if I ever need another ADR, I have every intention of heading back to Barcelona to see him. However, if you're willing to have a ProDisc implanted, from all I've read, there is probably no one on the planet better qualified to implant one than Dr Zigler at TBI. For all of the problems that I've read about of people that have received ProDiscs, not a single one of them has been one of Dr Zigler's patients. If I were having a ProDisc implanted, I'd have Dr Zigler do it.

Good luck, Jeff

[Vicki_in_Florida]

The thing that worried me was Dr. Zigler said that the M6 is having some issues when it comes to test of time. We were talking Lumbar.
He said if his mother or wife needed a disc, he would still take a prodisc over an m6.
That makes me concerned. If the Prodisc is so good, why aren't the European doctors still using it? Did he tell me that to keep me here in the US? He said to talks to the European doctors all the time by phone. They are having issues with the M6. That's all I was told.
He seemed very genuine and I don't think he would make this up if it weren't true.
I'm waiting to see what Dr. Boeree has to say.
Ugh! I just want to make a decision and get it over with already.