Looking for thoughts and advice - please help

[N2Fun]

I would just like to say it is a pleasure to be here. After being a compatative athlete my life has been shaken by the development of severe discogenic pain eminating from a degenerative L5-S1 disc.

After finding out I am candidate for ADR I have done extensive research which lead me to this site and the caring people that are here. I hope that I can gather some support from those who understand my situation and offer any of my own support or thoughts to all others.

Having attempted ALL conservtive measures with no success I appear to be staring surgery in the face. However, I am only four months along since the onset of pain so the docs say that they will not consider surgery until I have suffered this way for at least 2-3 more months and possibly more. I understand their timeline and am NOT looking to get into the OR at all, plus I appreciate having a doc who does not look for an excuse to operate. Still, at some point I want to know I am taking the necessary steps to get my life back.

My first question is has anyone had experience or heard of stories where discogenic low back pain did improve significantly over time. My second question would be a request to anyone willing to share their experience regarding how active they were able to be after ADR surgery. My final question (for know) would be how many opinions it is wise to gather from surgeons who perform ADR to be sure it is right for me.

I am happy to answer any additional questions and am so appreciative of any and all thoughts, advice, and good cheer. This experience has been challenging to say the least but I feel lucky to now be in such good company.

Best wishes

[N2Fun]

I thought a little more infor would be helpful. Two things: 1) after many diagnostic tests and many physical exams it is clear that the source of my pain is discogenic, it is likely not caused by any bulge or herniation but from the degeneration of the disc 2) My docs have said that they would not touch me surgically for several more months - fine by me. I just pray that time could have some positive affect on my disc, the pain, and my life.

Again, thank you all for your time and I hope to hear from you all soon.

Best wishes

[Harrison]

N2Fun, welcome to our community. But I must say, I feel you are too young for all this!? But many here in this community started this process when they were your age. Justin comes to mind, he had a multi-level procedure several years ago and seems to be doing fine while finishing med school...

But in the meantime, how are you managing the pain? Does any type of traction help, e.g. hanging? http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

PS: I deleted the duplicate topic in the other forum.

[Terry]

N2FUN:

I had ruptured my first disc around 22 years old and subsequently ruptured three more over the years. I have been athletic forever having bicycled across the United States at age 25. My first spinal surgery did not occur until age 38 when I had a hemi-laminectomy on my neck to remove bone spurs. I had 4 level ADR surgery November 4, 2006 and continue to be athletic. I went in to the surgery in good shape. Last Summer, while healing from this major surgery, I bicycled 2,234 miles on my bicycle.

You are young enough that you should look for every alternative possible before surgery. Surgery is a last resort in my opinion. Harrison asks good questions; i.e., traction?, pain management?, etc.

Hang in there and look for more than one opinion in the medical community.

Welcome to the forum, unfortunately.

Terry Newton

[Lisibug]

Hi N2fun. Sorry you're hurting so much. I have a friend who wrenched her low back, consisting of a bulging disc on MRI. She was crying with pain, couldn't walk and would crawl up stairs and spend most of the time in bed. This kind of pain lasted for 3 weeks and then slowly began to improve. She then began to do PT and has been doing treadmill, swimming and walking in the pool since that time. She now has NO low back pain. She knows she has to be careful in regards to lifting heavy things, etc., but she does this and keeps her back strong with these exercises and is in good shape. Hope the same will be true for you. I would venture to say that most people improve - I've known many people with back problems that resolve over time - unfortunately, it can take much longer than we'd like.

[N2Fun]

Thank you all for your caring thoughts and nice replies. I am in the process of seeing my docs again this month so hopefully I will have more answers soon. I agree that I am young to have to mess with this and I never saw it coming, but that is my reality right now so I need to face it head on to ensure good times in the coming years. Maybe my age can work as an advantage in healing.

As far as pain managment: 1) advil or aleve - I have tried all types of RX meds and none work better than OTC stuff, also I am trying as hard as possible to stay away from narcotic pain killers 2) stretching as directed by my PT 3) avoid sitting at all costs which is difficult at work - sitting is by far what gets me the worst. As far as traction, hanging from my feet seems to provide some temporary relief, but it is not long lasting and that has also been the case when my PT has done manual traction. Still, whenver I feel able to get to the gym to walk I try to finish by hanging for a bit.

Terry, you said that you ruptured your first disc at 22 and then rode across the country at 25 - how did you recover from that first disc to be able to ride, I miss riding so much.

I am hopeful that with time things will improve and that if I am able to feel better I can now apply the knowledge I have to take proper care of my back and keep it that way, but we'll see. I appreciate all of your thoughts and support so much. I look forward to hearing more.

Best wishes.

[Terry]

Sometimes discs heal on their own without surgical intervention. When the spaces narrow and nerves are compromised is when the surgeries start becoming more necessary if traction and conventional means do not take care of it.

Keep up the hope and effort on your part and you will ride again.

Terry Newton

[FIXITRIGHT]

Be sure and monitor the OTC meds you take. We lost a female college student in Oklahoma due to an Ibuprophen overdose over a few weeks. It built up in her system and shut her liver down. That's why it's sometimes better to take the prescribed meds to get the pain relief you need and not overdose doing it. I rotate between the narcotics and OTC pain meds to control the pain along with Flexerill. Just be careful, we don't want to lose anyone.

[N2Fun]

I closely monitor all the meds I take, and do not take an excessive amount but that is a good advice and something to definitely keep in mind. I am just not a big medicine guy, always believed my body could heal itself given the right amount of time, however it doesn't seem to be doing that here (or maybe I am just being to impatient).

If I could just sit for a reaonable amount of time it would make such a difference, its hard working all day either standing or typing while kneeling. Plus, I never understood before how such a drastic change in lifestyle and chronic pain can wear on you mentally. Still, I have a caring family and a great girlfriend (although I am probably not as open with her about my pain as I should be). With their help, the support and help I am finding here, and the understanding that there are ways out there to help me get better I am working to keep my spirits high.

The docs have said that my herniation can heal over time but that since they are almost certain that is not the cause of my pain they don't see it making a difference. I need to find someway to help deal with the degeneration I have in the disc. Who knows, maybe time will be on my side in these coming days.

Still looking into my options, I think that next is chiro - it and prolotherapy are pretty much my last non-surgical options it appears. With prolotherapry I have heard some very mixed results and undrestand it is $$$, chiro may help but my PT has done some basic chiro techniques without a dramatic effect but who knows. I will do whatever I am told and do so in good faith to know that am being as proactive as possible in my attempt to heal. Guess we'll see what the docs say. Thoughts anyone?

Hope you all are well today - best wishes.

[FIXITRIGHT]

I'm with you. I go to Therapy a few times a week and have seen a chiro without much change. In fact the more active I am the worse it gets. I rarely get sick and heal pretty fast usually but some things don't heal fast enough for the fast paced world we live in. No one had time to sit or lay around and heal. Sometimes it does take intervention. Quality of life. That's what it's all about.

[N2Fun]

I totally agree, quality of life is what its about! Normally moderate activity doesn't bother me, but I literally cannot sit for 5 miuntes wihtout the onset of pain. Maybe over time things will get better.

I wish I had a more definite timeline regarding the steps the docs want to take regarding my care - ex. after so many months wihtout improvement we will try "X" and if that doesn't work so many weeks later we will try "Y" eventaully leading to surgery if necessary. I think I struggle living with the feeling of living this way of an indefinite period of time.

I also know that there is a psychological factor to this situation, I simply have to try to work to focus on all the great htings I have and stay positive so that I do not stand in the way of my own recovery - any thoughts on this?

Hope everyone is having a great day!

[Cirobi]

Hi N2Fun,

I'm actually in a similar boat as you right now. i was always athletic up until the start of college in 2003. My back problems surfaced in high school with me yanking something in my back during time trials for track my sophomore year (2001-ish)

Last January (2007) they resurfaced with a vengeance when I literally stood up after using the ladies room and wound up in serious pain. My primary doc figured it was a muscle issue based off of the history i gave, but I pushed a bit and got him to send me for an XRAY. His initial reaction after an XRAY and Bone Scan were that it was arthritis but that diagnosis didn't sit well with me. I was 25 at the time, how the heck could I have "mild arthritis" and be in that much discomfort daily. I had another episode from bending over to spit out toothpaste last summer to which he said "well, that's the nature of the disease" and i was completely deflated. I weathered it out until this January when my insurance changed so i could make more decisions on my own for my care.

After an MRI, i found out I have two herniated disks at L4/L5 and L5/S1. i've been trying to get back to being more athletically active since i stopped most of everything when i first ran into regular pain issues. I've had to just grin and bear it to a certain extent without pushing myself too hard. The grin and bear it method has lost me 30-40 pounds in the process and i'm gunning for more thanks to finding that swimming laps including flip turns is still mostly ok.

I've done chiropractics, stretching, some PT (but no traction which i'm actually going to ask my doc about tomorrow) and anti-inflammatories. I wound up switching to over the counter stuff when the anti-inflammatories didn't do much for me, but i avoid taking anything unless the pain/discomfort is approaching the unbearable level. My ortho doc says I may be a candidate for a 2 level ADR, but had me go for a discography 2 weeks ago to see what exactly was going on in there. I find out the results tomorrow morning and am both nervous and excited.

I don't want to have surgery just yet and plan on getting more opinions before I take that plunge, but i'm so frustrated with dealing with this problem for approx 7 years that i've half resigned myself to the fact that i'll likely have to get surgery. heck, before i even had it resurface last january i had it in the back of my mind that eventually i'd be facing surgery since conservative the most simple pain management options weren't working or had minimal effect.

feel free to send me private messages if you want to chit chat and compare situations more or i'll just keep checking in on this thread. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[N2Fun]

Hi all,
I had an addtitional question....has anyone ever heard of an epidural steroid injection causing a condition to worsen. In Jan. I though I was getting better as I waited for my first ESI, then the same day my doc and I discussed cancelling it I suffered an onset of pain so we went ahead (first injection 1/28/08). Since that time my sitting tolerance is zero, worse than before. Has anyone heard of anything like this, could this be related to the ESI or is it more likely that the ESI just correlated in time to when my symptoms worsened?
Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Hope everyone is having a good day.