I've forwarded my information to Pro-Spine for evaluation.I am not afraid of the surgery, I am afraid that they will tell me to live with it, as I have been told over and over through the years by everyone from my g.p. to pain specialist to surgeon.I am almost sick worrying about it. How long does it usually take to hear back from Dr. B?

I would suggest some patience.

Depending upon how busy the Pro-Spine staff is, it may take a week (or longer) before you hear anything back.

From someone who has been through the process, trust me, Dr. B's staff is top notch!

Thanks.

David

First, Bertagnoli would only tell you to live with it if you think you can. The German mindset is to look at the whole life of the patient. If you think you can live with it, he'll tell you that surgery is at the patient's option. If you tell him that you can't live with it, he'll go forward with what can be done. He might not offer a surgery if you don't present strongly enough to figure out what's causing your pain but that's not telling you to live with it, that's saying he doesn't know what to fix. If that happens, there's a neurologist in Munich that's a wizard who might be able to help.

Second, I'd hold out at least two weeks to hear something.

David and Anna
Thanks for your support.Patience isn't always my strong point. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common.../icon_razz.gif
Deb

Hi Deb, Hang in there.

Reminds me that whenever I loose something, I find it in the last place I look.

My many rounds were like yours and I finally found my health in the last place I looked too.

Thanks,Bill. It has been a long, difficult road, but I finally feel I am headed in the right direction. Sounds like your doing well. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

It's been two weeks since I submitted my case for evaluation. I haven't heard from Pro-Spine and I am getting more anxious than ever.
A new question * Though I doubt there are any contraindications for facet injections,will it negatively affect adr? I was originally booked March 22 but it has been rescheduled for March 2.

classic
facet injections should not be a problem.
are they testing your facets or trying to treat them?
gather all your reports also for pro-spine the more info you can provide the better.
chuck

Hi Chuck
They are treating them. I had 3 epidural blocks last winter with no effect so I am rather sceptical this will work.I am booked for a bone density scan on Wednesday morning, otherwise all test results (including MRI and x-ray photos) have been submitted to Pro-Spine. Thx Deb

classic
good deal looks like you are all set for your trip to the other side.
anita,Dr. Bertagnoli and all the pro-spine staff are awesome you will receive care there that you would never see here. sad but true.
and the hospital staff at bogen are also truely amazing.
you surely will be in good hands.
chuck

I am keeping fingers,toes and anything else I can cross,crossed. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...on_biggrin.gif Arrrgh...I hate waiting!!!I want my life back!

Hi Deb,
It's great to see another Canadian posting here. I am in Calgary. I have consulted with Dr.B. It can take a while, but don't worry. They'll get to you.

Did you by any chance have any consults in Canada? There is a NS at London HSC who has co-authored at least one research paper with Dr.B. and does ADR. His name is Neil Duggal. It could save you a wad of cash.(Might be a long wait, though...)

We were told by Anita that Prospine ran into server problems and are still waiting for a reply to an email we sent a week and a half ago.

Hi Fortitudine
Nice to meet a fellow Canuck on here!Are you going to Germany?I am very lucky in that my family have been very supportive both emotionally and financially with my decision to seek surgery out-of-country.

I saw Dr. David Taylor at LHSC Spine Centre in November. He only does one level and said because I need 2-level, I am not a candidate. He offered me facet injections under fluroscope and narcotics.So now I am a stoned,drooling moron... http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...on_biggrin.gif LOL... at least that's how I feel most days!There was another poster from Ontario who recommended Dr. Gurr out of London, but the wait is more than a year.I feel I am running out of time. I am not able to walk more than 1/2 block before severe pain and numbness from mid-back to feet sets in.I am unable to work as I am a nurse employed at a nursing home and the workload is heavy.My hubby (bless his heart) has to do almost all the housework,frequently has to help me dress and puts up with my bad nights which occur 4-5 times per week.My nights have improved some with a combination of Demerol and Flexeril,but I certainly do have cognitive impairment due to all the meds I am on.My pain level remains at 6 - 8 on a daily basis with spikes of 9 - 10 a little less frequently.

Best of luck to you.
Deb http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

Thanks, Anna!
Hopefully,I will hear back from them soon. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

I am so relieved as I spoke with Anita this morning. She put both myself and hubby at ease that we made the right decision to look to Pro-Spine to "fix" my back. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common.../icon_razz.gif

Great news! Anita is incredible, as is Dr. Bertagnoli / Fenk-Mayer and the entire staff.

Keep us posted.

Justin

classic
you will have no regrets having pro-spine work there magic.
please keep us posted.
chuck

Agreed 100%.

Let me know if you need a translator, as another trip to Germany would be fun http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common.../icon_wink.gif

David

This past week has been especially tough for me. I am a very optimistic person and have a very high pain tolerance.Between a chronic pain level of 7 - 8 (that's with Demerol,Flexeril and Amitriptyline) and the stress caused by Comp cutting my temporary total disability benefits off last October,I lost hope and for the first time,I was sinking into a depression. Speaking to Anita relieved a lot of stress and anxiety and I seem to have regained my optimism.I very much appreciate the support on this forum and I don't feel alone in this journey anymore. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

Can those of you who have gone to Germany tell me about your experiences, ie.flights,accomodations,hospitalization,etc?

classic
book flights biz class at least 8 weeks out or they become unfordable if you book out far enough you can get for about 2500.00 each.
also get a account with www.xe.com
you will save alot of money on the wire tranfers and exchange rate as we saved 1000.00 using them.
hotels depend on where you are having your surgery.
i was in bogen and my wife stayed at the am platz and they found it afordable and the owners were very helpfull also the hospital is in walking distance. oh and its cheaper then the hospitals in straubing as straubing is a much larger town.
hotel in straubing is romemheh {spelling}
owner also very nice and speaks english.
get your self one of those books for tranlators.
also get power adapters at radioshack. there about 40.00 each should only need 2. and if taken a laptop invest in a good surge suppressor.
both hospital rock after seeing straubing hospital i liked the bogen hospital as it need a balcony for myself and wife to step out on to have a smoke.
and your husband will love this they sell beer in the gift shop {grin} i liked that to.
any other questions feel free to email me.
chuck
ps when is your surgery?

Chuck
I don't have surgery booked yet.I am very optimistic at this point that ADR is right for me (local surgeon stating I need 2-level and he only does 1-level).With the info I am given,I can prepare and be ready when given the go ahead to procede with surgery.Do I get a choice of location -Bogen or Straubing? Yup,my hubby will love beer from the giftshophttp://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...on_biggrin.gif Keep him occupied while I am under the knife!Thx for the great advice.How are you feeling at almost 7 months post-op?
Deb

classic
im sure if you request it they may be able to allow you to chose between the 2 hospitals.
a question for anita.
i am doing well no pain in the back to speak of.
still have alot of distraction pain but i had ZERO disc space left to the point where dr. bertagnoli had to undo the auto fusion of the bones at L4-L5
chuck

I'm glad your doing well.Thank goodness you know that the distration pain will pass. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

There's at least one FAQ about advice for Bogen that we submitted several years ago and I think other have added their own.

I am getting so discouraged.Another two weeks have gone by and I have heard nothing from Pro-Spine.I went for facet injections last Friday and overall,there has been no improvement.In fact,the past two nights have been awful with my pain level at 9 and my left leg completely numb and tingling. http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...n_confused.gif

So sorry to hear you're down!! I remember how hard that time was for me-unfortunately I didn't find this forum until I was post-op! I guess it's good news that the facet blocks didn't do anything, as it's a sign that they're not a pain generator, right? It's awful that you're in so much pain though. I really don't have any earth-shattering advice, just wanted to say hang in there-you'll be happy you went this route in the long run. Keep us updated!

You might wish to try again. Pro-spine lost their server connection for a while then lost a more time getting back to us due to other problems. Your contact email might have been lost in the shuffle.

You might try waking up early one morning and calling. The office will not help directly but they will send you on to the overseas coordinator, who did help us and got things sorted out.

I left a voice mail for Anita yesterday. I also forwarded the lumbar spine questionnaire and MRI report to AlphaKlinik yesterday. I received a response from Linda this morning. Since both clinics have great reputations, I don't really care which one I end up (hopefully) going to. I really appreciate all the support I get on this forum. It is such a difficult journey.

Hi there,

I notice you're from Ontario! I live in Toronto and I had my 2 level in Canada (Montreal) fully covered by OHIP last year. Montreal General Hospital by Dr. P. Jarzem and he performs 2 levels ADR.

PM if you wish to have more info.

Hi Rosie
Wow!Thanks for the info;I will certainly look into it.How long was your wait, first for consult and then for surgery?

Things are moving along. I finally heard from Pro-Spine, both from Dr. Fenk-Mayer and Anita.I had forwarded info to Alpha Klinik as well, and Dr. Frank has been really great, confirming he's received my emails and keeping me up-to-date with the evaluation. On Friday, he said that their expert, Dr. Bertagnoli would have to review my case and make the final decision as it is complex. Surprisingly, he said I have a "serious degeneration" at L1-L2 (which only stands to reason as I suffered a wedge compression fracture of the L1 back in 1989 when I was assaulted at work). I really have to wonder how 4 radiologists (x-rays, 2 MRI's, and a CT scan in the past couple years) and the surgeon I saw in November, missed it. I pulled my x-rays and viewed the MRI images again,sure enough I saw what Dr. Frank saw. I rec'd my Bone Density report and thank goodness,it is normal.I am waiting to hear from Dr. Roy and Dr. Jarzem in Quebec. If I can have surgery done in Quebec, OHIP will pay for it as it has been approved by Health Canada.However, I am preparing myself mentally for a trip to Germany as I want the best possible outcome (don't we all!). http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common.../icon_cool.gif

Hi,

I'm really interested to hear about the issue with your L1/2. My MRI shows degeneration and bulge at that level, which has been ignored by 2 specialists, despite me emphasising the problem/pain I can feel in my spine at that level. I have had a number of new symptoms in the last 2 years (after 30 years of problems lower down!) that only make sense with a new (higher) level involvement.

I also had a (very!) positive discography at this level. Yet the last consultant I saw for an opinion told me that my problem is only with L3/4 - his rationale being that "it's very uncommon for the disc to cause a problem at L1/2". When I tried to discuss it further, he expanded by saying "it's very rare". Not much of a clinical argument in my book!! But I wonder whether this may have something to do with people ignoring yours?

I'll be REALLY interested to know what is Dr. Bertagnoli's opinion of your L1/2 problem. (I'd hoped to get an opinion from him myself, but my last MRI is too old to be considered and its really expensive for me to get another one done now). My understanding is that it is anatomically very difficult to do ADR at that level. I'm currently looking at the options of fusion or more probably Dynesis at that level with the specialist who did my discogram and in whom I have the most confidence. I will probably have this done at the same time as ADR at L3/4.

Hi Rosedee
I am pretty anxious to hear from Dr. Bertagnoli. I have never had a discogram. The surgeon I saw in November said I had "mechanical low back with sciatica" and said any number of people who have no back pain have an MRI that looks like mine and that I am in a very small percent of the population who have pain. Long before my appointment, he had already labeled me as a low-level, non-surgical priority. I think a big part of the problem is universal healthcare. The wait to see a specialist is months if not years and patients are put through like cattle. All of my various reports since 2000 only focus on L4 - S1. I didn't know that ADR is difficult at the L1-L2 level. I guess I need to research this more.
Good luck to you and I will let you know the verdict when it's in.
Deb