I previously posted as HARLEYS DAD I lost all of my records & re registered. After eight months of batteling my Insurance Co. ( a divission of BCBS ) I finaly got my approval letter in August & they are paying 100% of the cost. That's the good news. I got the approval the second week of August & had my surgery scheduled for ADR at the L/5 S/1 on August 26th. The morning of the surgery at the Hospital I was informed that the surgery was cancled. Needless to say it was a major dissapointment. It was re scheduled for 11/11/2005. I called today to see what time I had to be there & was told by the same Nurse that it was cancled again. I asked her how, with seven weeks notice did it get cancelled. She said that the Vascular surgeon had something come up. I later called his office to find out if he had in fact been notified seven weeks in advance as I was & found out that his office was not aware of it untill today. It turns out that this one Nurse that does all of the scheduling for the clinic never coordinates with the other surgeons involved untill a couple of days prior to the surgery. I was very up set & she said she didn't have time to deal with a rude paitent & hung up on me. I called back to South Eastern Spine Institute in Mt Pleasant, SC to leave a message for my surgeon to call me. I specificaly asked the reseptionist to not give the message to Nurse Karen Blakley because I knew she would intercept it & I wouldn't get to speak with my DR. About two hours went by & she called & said "You just made a big mistake" I asked what she meant & she said that she was given the message & told that I didn't want her to intercept it. It was then that she told me that I would have to find another surgeon. She said she told DR Johnson that I was extreemly rude & demanding & that he told her to tell me to find someone else to do my surgery. I've been going there for two years & they have me on 200 mg of Morphine per day for pain. I don't know what to do now! Any advise, help would be greatly appreaciated. I feel as though they may have even broken the law by just dropping me like this given the severity of my condition. I can't work, & can only stand for short periods. I haven't slept in a bed in almost two years. I have to sleep sitting in my recliner, where i spend about twenty two hours each day. My pain managment Dr told me about two months ago that if I didn't get a surgery soon that I was risking serious nerve damage. Any suggestions anyone?

Maybe this is a blessing in disguise. If your surgeon is so quick to believe whatever this nurse so-and-so says with no other info, then maybe he's not the one you want working on your spine. Unless you only have local-area insurance coverage, you've got lot's of options. You could try TBI, Cedars, Dr. Bitan, and the other top-notch US ADR surgeons. You could go to Dr. Bertagnoli or Zeegers in Europe. You could look for other competent ADR surgeons near where you live. This guy isn't the only good surgeon in the world. Don't let yourself be bullied by vengeful office staff.

Best,
Laura

Treatment like that would send up a caution flag in my head. If that practice is so lazy to wait till the last minute to schedule support surgeons, I would be afraid of what they forgot to do the day of surgery. You would think the nurse would have more compassion for someone who had their surgery cancelled 2x due to their incompetence. I am sure there are other surgeons in SC that will treat you better than an assembly line product. Go to the charite site and look in their trained physicans section for SC. This was probably a blessing in disguise.

Imagine if the surgery caused complications, sounds like they would call you a complainer and hang up on you or tell you to find another Dr. to go fix it....

There are plenty of fish in the pond, personally I would report this guy to the State medical board....

Best of Luck!!!

How about taking an add out in your local paper letting your community know how this doctor and his office has treated you and left you to suffer in pain even when you have coverage. I don�t get it. Other patients should be warned as to what they are getting themselves into.

Thank goodness you will not have to continue being treated badly there are a lot of compassionate doctors that would put there patients over there office staff. I wonder if he really knows what is going on and if he does I would not let him near me with a ten-foot pole let alone a scalpel.

Hi Dad,
What an absolute nightmare! Each member here can sympathize with your frustration. I would certainly consider calling your state medical board and any other professional organization. Also there are sure to be more highly qualified orthopaedic surgeons in the area. I had 4 opinions before selecting my ADR specialist. Don't give up, persevere, this may end up being a blessing in disguise.

This is an awful thing to happen and twice at that. I would report these incidents like Luvmysibe suggested and also report the rude and disrespecful treatment you experienced over the phone from the nurse and the office person to a local medical entity or your insurance company. If it was me I'd also be asking for a written apology. I hope you can find a good surgeon soon.

Stay away from inflammatory language... just cool, calm recitation of the events.

I recommend taking a very short version of your story and putting it into a FAX to your doctor. That enters it into your medical record and gives the doctor something that he really needs to respond to. Make it clear to the doctor that you are interested in having him perform the surgery... you have no beef with him... it's just that your life is turned upside-down and all you are trying to do is find the appropriate relief... doing what HE recommends.

Mark

It sounds to me as if this is not isolated to you, I know we all have pressures on ourselves in this modern day, especially the nurses but it sounds as if there are a number of nurses who are very high-handed about things.

I don't know if members have the facilities, but it might help members in the future to record all phone calls if there's any suspicion of this sort of problem.

Many doctors rely on their nurses to keep troublesome people away from them -- -- -- the above is just a thought.

When I was working, many conversations with insurance companies who offered big bonuses for certain contracts, and then when you did the contracts retracted on their original offer. I used to record all the relevant conversations, and if this happened to me I would just send them a copy of the conversation, with a note that said do you wish me to take this further? I look forward to your cheque.

There's loads of surgeons want your money out there, be careful what you say if you put an advert in your local paper as suggested by someone
best,
Alastair http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

Proud Dad,
I worked 25 years as a nurse and have seen many a doctor/surgeon back his nurse in terms of report of problematic patient/dismissal from services.

Sometimes it's very unfair as the patient truly isn't problematic, just frustrated as in your case. Patient's often don't understand they are supposed to be polite and feel wonderful about some very impolite, unfair or rude behavior that they receive.. (and of course then there are your true problematic patients tho they can be more difficult to dismiss).

I believe for the most part, most physicians reserve the right to treat whom they desire. Sometimes there are cases that involve continuity and the physician or surgeon cannot dismiss the patient so easily but for the most part, when it's done it's done and the patient must find a new treating doctor.

I'm very sorry this happened to you, however, what Laura said rings very true re a possible blessing in disguise. Would you really want someone to do surgery on your whose services were run as such and whose nurse treats you in this manner? I think not.

Hopefully there has been no documentation to the effect of Problematic patient on your chart (rude, demanding and such) so that it will not be difficult to find a new treating doctor. However, you must do that now, and you must make sure you explain in a calm and rational manner what happened to you to the next treating doctor and by all means don't "trash" the x doctor too badly verbally as other physicians/surgeons pick up on this and feel that the patient may be problematic and therefore turn him or her away without giving them much of a chance.

Good luck, if you've an attorney involved, try to have the attitude thing rectified or removed from documentation with an addendum such as * Mr X was scheduled for surgery twice and without any advance notice from anyone involved in his treating care was canceled from surgery and not notified until he showed up at the hospital doorstep....

This will allow for a new treating doctor to understand where your frustration w/treatment was and that you were in no way a problematic patient, only desired an explanation from your treating physician.

take care, good luck, and hang in there~ Maria

Dad; there are some very great responses here to assist your already painful / frustrating circumstances. What caught my eye was the word 'compassion' was used several times here.

Just to let you know that you are not alone -
This occured with an attending Pain Management doc of mine that saw me thru 2 surgeries referring me to good surgeons etc, saw me for more than 2 years less than 5 we will just say here.

At one point he AND his RN diagnosed and approved an increase in medications for extreme pain. Yet - they did not increase the dosages via an actual prescription. (Neither he or the RN 'charted' the fact that they increased dosages)

What this did in the long run was caused a mismatch in my dates and when I could be filled. This was 2 months later because of overlapping doc visits etc, however when I went in to fill 2 months later the pharmasist explained that the fill date was not until TWO days later.

I was to run out 3 tablets early - 1.5 days less than when they could fill!

When I called them at the doc's office I was calm...they were rude to me, they had NEVER been rude to me, as a matter of fact we had a great relationship - friendly to the max.

(At this point in the telephone call, not only was I feeling like an addict - the way they were addressing me made me feel horrible. 'Problematic' when I had never been..But I could feel it over the phone: They had made a decision 'practice wide' that they would not comply with patients, ANY patients that ran out and were calling to get a sympathetic ear...or just a refill when they should have charted the increase?!) They just changed, presto chango, snotty on the phone?! Gosh.

When I questioned why the prescrip could not be filled, They told me that I should not only have enough for those 1.5 days = 3 pills later...because I should have enough for 8 more days!
(Thus, I brought up the 'Verbal' increase of meds for a few days that week I was in the hospital for an EMERGENCY Injection that HE approved!!!, seemed that not only did they NOT remember the increase and was not charted.)

That compassion word came out of my mouth. I asked them how they could possibly watch me get ill because I ran out? "Where is your compassion for one of the honest ones there? Would you really do this because you have been burned by others?" That was it. All I said...

The call ended without the prescrip approval and I just sat there - like you are, without meds. My only support was here. People helped me thru the rough days. (Thankfully and a scary time for me)

He dismissed me without a trace and then cleared papers saying that I was fixed and stable...all the while just a few months prior he was jutting for a surgery for me and many other ideas of what to do for me physically.
-------

Amen to this being a blessing in disguise. Maybe. I am not sure yet. I am in the recovery mode of trying to save my claim. What was written by them in dismissal papers and then all of the insurance papers to return me to work they even wrote that they 'felt decieved' and it got much worse just so they could CYA. (Cover THEIR rears)
--

Document everything - be patient, kind and respect the docs that treat us, I guess.
It is hard because they do not even realise that the very meds they give us to barely survive and live a life of scale 4 pain VS. 9...They cannot see that the meds allow us to get outside and live again. Compassion? I am not sure, I feel like they want us to kiss their A** just to remain under their blessed care!
------
Be tough in your endeavors, be graceful in all things. You will eventually put this back together and seek the help that you SO deserve! I pray for your surgery to be fulfilled and SOON dad. I am sorry that you have come up against this wall.
-----

I vented a little here - only to let you know that you are liked by all of us here and we share the same dang troubles, FRUSTRATING troubles! Good Luck and know that we care


BB

I initially had some problems with communication with my surgeon. After my surgery, he took me off all pain medicines and I had been on several medicines before my surgery. I was in severe pain. My surgeon did not understand at all. This misunderstanding undercut our communication. When I went to my first appointment the PA informed me I had some subsidence and I had been in enormous pain since lowering pain meds with my pain management doctor. I did not feel I could communicate with my doctor. I left the office feeling quite at a loss as I didn't question the doctor once he came into the room. The pain became immense over the next week. I E-mailed mmglobal as he is very knowledgable about xrays, etc. He advised me to fax my doctor. I did just that, explaining how I felt and informing him of the questions and concerns I had. The doctor called me and we ended up with open communications. Maybe this is a method you could use??? Have you attempted to put in writing just how you feel? It may not work at this late state but I felt my story may help you. I am hoping you get the help you need. I am praying for you to find the right doctor for you. The doctor also may not even know what is going on???

Thank each & everyone of you so very much for the kind words & various suggestions. It's always nice to know that there is someone out there to be able to share these type of issues with & receive such real & sincere understanding. Today I simply did nothing as I figured to give it a little time for things to calm down. My plan is to visit my pain managment Dr who is of course the one that supplies me with the nessesary medications to make it from day to day while awaiting surgery. I feel that after explaining what transpired between myself & the surgeon's nurse that he may take a proactive roll in communicating with my surgeon. It's my opinion that my surgeon has no idea of what is even going on. If he has heard anything I'm sure that it's been completely spun in favor of the nurse in order to make me come across as completely abnoxious, rude, demanding & understanding. I'll be the first to admitt that at times I can lose my temper & come across as rude. I also know that this was not the case here. I only asked in a normal tone why was I being cancled for a second time with no notice. Personally, I feel as if for some reason it's personal between the nurse & myself. She doesn't like the fact that I questioned her & when I asked to speak with my Dr on the phone myself is when she really became completely irate. She said no one goes over her head, she does all surgery scheduling & that I would not be allowed to speak with him now or ever. I actually found myself begging her for another surgery date & she said she didn't care if I personaly came into the office on my hands & knees, her mind was made up. She was tired of having to explain her actions to me & to find another Dr. I'm hoping that my pain mgnt. Dr can explain how desperately I need & want this surgery & see where it goes from there. If I can't get anywhere after trying to go through the pain mgnt. Dr then I'll begin my search for another surgeon. I do fortunately have 100% ins. coverage & for that I'm very gratefull. I just can't imagine that my surgeon actualy knows what is going on with his nurse & how she want's to play God within their office. If I have to go elsewhere it's then that I'll use every tool at my disposal to expose their office for what they put me through. I'll contact all of the local media & the South Carolina Board of Medical Examiners. I'll also persue legal action for paitent misstreatment & anything else a money hungry attorney can come up with. I've done nothing to deserve this kind of treatment & will not allow it to happen to another paitent if at all possible. Thanks again so, so much for all of your kind thoughts & letters. I'll keep you informed. THANK YOU ALL & GOD BLESS!!!

Proud Dad,
Just wanted to say, also, sometimes the decision not to do the surgery or for treatment or whatever has nothing to do with the patient. Like someone else mentioned, there can be a blanket decision to not care for XYZ treatment/procedures/patients(insurance wise) anymore.
It would be nice if at least you were given an apology and an explanation, not to mention called ahead of time so that you didn't waste all this time and maybe others time in terms of planning and arranging for your surgical date and post op care..
Sad that medicine has come to this..

Hang in there, Proud Dad. We're here for you. We can understand your feelings (emotionally and physically) better than many of the health care providers out there since we've been through it. A couple of days before my surgery I was told that it had to be pushed out two weeks because of instrumentation problems. That bummed me out, but it's nothing compared to what you've been through. I like the feeling from others that this could be a blessing in disguise. I hope you find your solution soon.

I agree with others on hear that said proabably a blessing in disguise. Be sure to go and get a copy of your medical record. You have a right to it. Maybe you can even get nurse so and so to give it to you. That would inflame her. She would probably deny it to you which would give you some more recourse for their shodiness.

Proud Dad,

I just want to let you know that I care about your situation too. Even if you were "rude" and "demanding" (which you weren't -- but it would be understandable) -- what do they expect from a man who is in severe unrelenting pain who sits in a chair almost all hours of the day! Zero empathy from them. If you can find another doctor/nurse combo that are receptive to you and communicative that seems like your best bet. Also, writing/faxing is a thought because it would seem the nurse can't just intercept mail for the doctor. But.... they've shown you what they're about by cancelling twice. I think you'll be better off elsewhere. I pray that you will find the strength and stamina to try to switch doctors...I know it's not easy being in that much pain. Good luck Fiddle

As promossed, I'm posting today after just leaving my first meeting with my "new" surgeon. After being dropped from my prior Dr's care due to two cancled ADR surgerys on their part, I met with the Surgeon that they refered me to today. he is the only other Dr in the area that does this proceedure. I had previously been going to a surgeon that performs several ADR's per week & did them during vthe study as well. He seemed perfectly fine with reccomending me for Charite disc replacment after my disc-o-gram last July. I battlet my Ins Co for 8 Months before gaining 100% approval for the ADR. Now today I meet with this new surgeon at the Medical University of South Carolina. They are well known for thier cutting edge, state of the art techknowledgy. This new surgeon review all of my film & paitent history from my previous Dr at Southeastern Spine Institute, his name is DR Glaser. He too is well respected in his field & has an outstanding reputation. However his first comment to me was "why do you want to have an artificial disc replacment instead of fussion?" He was leaning towards fussion which I could have had over a year ago. I've waited all this time just so I could get the ADR & not a fussion. He said that the Charite disc is very new techknowledgy & not yet proven over a long period as is the fussion. I told him why I didn't want fussion as it usually only leads to further fussions in the future. My previous Dr had scheduled me for ADR surgery two times & both wers cancled by the Clinic. Now after meeting with Dr Glaser at MUSC today he has me worried about having ADR. He said it can lead to many complications , Death, Blood clots in the legs, lack of acceptable recovery, & somekind of ejaculation problem ( I forget what he called it ) that I've never heard of. he said he has performed 6 proceedures with four positive results & two with complications. I told him that my mind was made up to go with the ADR & he said he would have his staff get the ball rolling & that they will be in touch with a date. I now feel very nervous about my decession. I told him about all of the positive results I read about in this forum & he said that usually the only people that participate in these forums are either those who know nothing & trying to get some kind of info, those who had a sucessfull surgery & wanted to share it & a few that had a bad experience & wanted to share it.
Is there anyone that has gone through anything similar to this where you get one surgeon that says certainly that ADR is the way to go & then another who is more inclined to do a fussion? I still want the Charite disc but must admit, this guy has me somewhat nervous now. I've had seven prolo injections in the same area about two years ago from a Dr that was certain that that would cure me. My new Dr says that the Prolo injections make the surrounding tissue very tough & less likely to benifit from ADR????

Hi Proud Dad,
You should have told this Dr that ADR and the Charitee has been done since 1989 and earlier in
Europe with good results even though there are some risks those are not usuallly a big problem.

Retro ejaculation is what he was talking about

You wanted ADR because it kept that joint moving and would not affect the other adjacent joints.

There is all about Prolothereapy in the FAQ`s as all this above information is.

What a shame you didn`t know this Dr was going to try and push you into a fusion. You could have armed yourself with these facts
Best
Alastair http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

I hate to harp on this, as I have mentioned it in a few other posts, but even at the spine symposium, multiple doctors indicated that fusion can still be a good solution for certain patients. If I just needed L5/S1 fixed I would have gone with the fusion unless I had a very experienced doctor and my insurance would pay for it. I would not consider a doctor with 6 surgeries under his belt experienced. ADR is a complicated surgery and I would rather have the fusion than ADR with someone who may not be the sharpest tool in the shed in that arena. I would consider someone with closer to 100 surgeries to be fairly experienced.

One level, particularly L5/S1 which has no lower adjacent levels, is probably the best bet for fusion. On another note, my original doctor didn't want me to have either one. He and my primary care physician both said back surgery is a mixed bag, 1/3rd show marked improvement, 1/3rd end up worse than before and 1/3rd show no change. I think a lot of people seek surgery without trying a lot of other things first, and that skews the numbers. But people who clearly have spinal issues for years and have tried it all only for it to continue to degenerate and nno longer have good quality of life, clearly need something done.

Good luck on your continued quest!

Juli,
Thank you very much for your input & comments! What you say holds alot of merit. The original Dr that I had the surgery scheduled with had over 100 ADR surgeries under his belt & I had no reservations about my choice to have the Charite disc replacment. I just don't get the same feeling with this Dr.

It's a great idea to get to a doctor who has had the least 60 ADR surgeries under his belt if you possibly can.
Best,
Alastair http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_smile.gif

Proud Dad,

Boy does this sound all too familiar. I had several conflicting opinions about my cases. Dr Regan said ADR-Charite and Dr Bray his former partner said fuse and not to do the Charite. Regan had 300 ADR and Bray how also participated in the US trial for the Charite had 150 A patient told me he is no longer installing the Charite.

Some doctors are just not ready to embrace new technology and Regan said that there is a learning curve with the Charite and after this first 25 he was able to work out the problems.

With that said I am very happy with my decision to have ADR with Dr Delamarter and the ProDisc 300+ discs installed. Good with come out of this situation for you as well just don�t rush into something you don�t feel 100% comfortable with.

Dear Proud Dad

I am going through the process of having my insurance company deny (1st denial) my Charite ADR. I found DuPuy's website and talked to a man named John at DuPuy about tips to appeal insurance denials. His phone number is 504-828-3744. Anyway, I was told by my Doctor that DuPuy did not want any surgeon using the Chrite ADR unless they have extensive experience and that DuPuy would see to it that the procedure would be denied. DuPuy wants the Charite ADR to be a sucess. Are you able to travel to see another surgeon who has at least 60 or more ADR surgeries? I would NOT let anyone else touch me. There have been some bad outcomes from surgeons who didn't have enough experience.

If your insurance compay does not cover any other areas, Spinal Motion is doing a clinical trial on the Kineflex. There are two locations in North Carolina that are having the trials. Here is their information:

Triangle Orthopaedic Associates, PA
Thomas A. Dimming, MD
120 William Penn Plaza
Durham, NC 27704
Contact Name: Tabitha M. Paynter or Richard Malloy
Ph: 919-281-1720, 919-281-1780
Email: tpaynter@triangleortho.com
Email: rmalloy@triangleortho.com
Website: www.triangleortho.com

Caolina NeuroSergery & Spine Assoc.
Dom Coric, M.D.
1010 Edgehill Road North
Charlotte, NC 28207
Contact name: Peggy Bolts
Ph: 704-371-5105
Email: peggy.bolts@cnsa.com
Website: www.carolinaneurosurgery.com


I recommend you call DuPuy and ask if there is another good surgeon in your area as well. Some of the doctors listed on the Charite website have only performed one or two Charite ADR's. Check to see if your surgeon will be assisted in your surgery with one or more experienced Charite ADR surgeons. That is what my doctor is doing. She is having two surgeons from Las Vegas fly in who have performed hundreds of Charite ADR surgeries to assist.

God bless. Margaret

Margaret

insurance companys r out right dening the charite period only a hand full r covering it. i lost 3 appeals with blue crap http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_frown.gif and dr balderston was listed on dupuy site at pa hosp http://adrsupport.org/groupee_common...icon_frown.gif now looking into activ-l clinical trials here or im going overseas.
my best chuck