Thanks for the backup Stone!

This is why my screen name is Franklysir (i don't give a darn)

No need to boot me or Stone.

If you feel this conversation is not appropriate for public viewing then I will retract it. I don't see the value of being negative and arguing or being argumentative on here brings nothing to the table.

More importantly Bwink needs to make an informed choice and should be directed to get answers from the source. Clavel is a dedicated, professional and very personable man. He is more concerned with helping people then updating his website.

I will be contacting him to speak about this subject since i don't feel good about a fine man's reputation possibly being tainted without having all the facts.

Feel good Stone!
Oh and i answered your survey "why go to Europe"

Bwink,

Thank you. It just cut me the wrong way especially since I have been to Clavel twice within six months.

Im glad you know to read between clinical results vs actual or what the typical person thinks about as success.

My concern really was your question was not answered. I hope my feedback helps your venture. I am awaiting my first claim outcome for the cervical before submitting my Lumbar. Should know this week.

Frank

Stone,

"Turn off" everything is good advice...got to pick up the ball and run sometime. I'm at a point in the decision process that if i take a different avenue(like staying in the U.S. and getting a Prodisc), i would always wonder if i cheated my body for the sake of a few dollars( or thousands)...i can always make more money, but health decisions are permanent.

FranklySir,

Good luck on getting your claim reimbursement. I also have BCBS, keep me posted on your results. Were you given itemized billing before your departure?? Yolanda said i would get it in an email 10-15 days after i leave...but i talked to another poster who said they got it before they left.

Bwink,

A couple of observations/speculations...

The cost of my double ADR with Clavel four years ago was $29.6k, $9000 of which was for the two M6-C's. It looks like the cost of the implants are almost all of your cost increase by adding cervical to the package surgery. While it doesn't sound like it, he might be giving you a bargain by adding the cervical now?

$67k ... For that kind of price, I'd look at some other possible surgeons too . You are having a lot done, but that does sound more like a US price. Perhaps Clavel has gotten busy enough that he's rationing his time with price? I suppose that's a good problem to have. Wish I had that problem.

Good luck, Jeff

Has anyone looked at a US medical bill lately (especially for an inpatient stay)? How are we even comparing cost?

Bwink,

I was turned down for ADR surgery here in the U.S. I was told that I didn't do enough non-invasive pre-presurgical treatment; BS! I had given them a 5 year report of my extensive pre-surgical failed protocol - didn't matter. In the end, the FDA rules and insurance standards rule over best practice and logical care - who cares about you (right?).

US surgeons are limited to restricted procedures. You MUST be your own advocate. It is the body you are going to live with in the end. $67K may seem a lot for European medical cost; but not compared to what you will pay here. I agree with you about the M6 - I didn't want any other device (and that was after my OWN extensive research and inquiry). AND, as we have spoken through "PM," you stand a good chance of receiving insurance reimbursement because it is an accepted form of corrective surgery and medically approved for 12+ years (in respect to the M6) and 20+ for ADR alone in EUROPE.

In my opinion, I believe you had made a confident, well thought, and educated decision about having your surgery overseas. The only downside was finding a competent neurologist to do follow-ups upon my return in the event I experienced any problems. Found one - so that entity was eliminated.
My 2-level cervical was 28000 euros or roughly $37,000 US. Lumbar, I would imagine, would be slightly more expensive due to its intricacies. If you're concerned about the price - by all means inquire with a few other experienced surgeons (run it by Dr. Bierstedt - at this time he does not charge a consultation fee). You're focus is getting your body back and performing in the way it was meant to be...that's priceless! The cost (less what you will be refunded by your insurance company - optimism) will be less than the purchase of a car - and will last you much longer.

You're on the right road - My best wishes for you.
Laura

Bwink,

Yup, you have to shut out the noise once you have enough info. Good point Stone. Snake eating the tail if you don't and no decision will be made.

The itemized billing is a little slow depending on how busy the hospital is. I would ask Yolanda when you arrive to see if you can get it before you leave but most likely you won't.

Well considering I just spent 86-88K for both lumbar and cervical doubles when done seperately 67K sounds like a bargain especially when you add in first class both ways (deifnately on the return nonstop if possible). The good thing about getting both you will save $ but will pay in extra pain BUT one recovery. Your neck should be very good before you leave the hospital and giving you minimal if any pain. Your throat probably will be more sore though since the traic tube will be in alot longer but again your hospital stay will be 5-6 days. Clavel won't kick you out unless you are ready so dont worry and they won't charge you more.

I can't see even with flights anyone in the US doing four levels for that kind of $.

Wishing you peace of mind and spirit. Small mountain to climb but the other side is quite awesome. I'll be praying for a very uneventful surgery for you wherever you go.

All the best,
Frank

Thanks to all the responders...couldn't ask for a better support group than what i've found here. I hope for further progress in your recoveries, and will keep everyone posted when i make the transition to the bionic man.

I feel bad that I have had so little time to be on the site lately. I plan on posting my 6 month report in the next few days but wanted to comment here: 1)Laura sums up most of what I would add, 2) My US doc(Dr. Cappuccino) had 2 options for me-a) he could perform hybris wit fusion and 2 kineflex discs thru AIMIS in Cyprus, or b) he would be my follow-up doc of record if I choose to go to Europe for 3 M6's. I think his options for me say a lot, neither one was surgery in the US. He said he would not even consider the prodisc for multi-level.
Harrison, I cannot thank you enough for starting this site which helped me find the help I needed, but why have you been so against European surgeons? My US doc even made it clear that my best choices were not available in our country. Within 3 minutes of seeing me for the first time he said, "you know if you can, you ned to go to Europe." Believe me, I am not happy about this, going to Germany to pay for a surgery out of pocket and the disc is made in the US!!!!