[Fortitudine]

Okay, I'm back with my solution - aquacize, keeps everything gently moving.Works for me. Plus regular NSAIDS.

Then, as we age, we don't all sleep as well as we used to.

As for diagnosis, I think we all know that the spine is really one of the new frontiers. Not that much known about it. Docs can't always tell what the pain generators are. If you go onto BrainTalk you'll see the truth of that. Look at Eyeguy's story. Not that it's any consolation.

But it's well known that you can get into a vicious circle/downward spiral of pain/frustration/depression/loss of sleep/increased sense of pain/increased depression...

You have really been looking hard for solutions Biff; I sure hope you find some help soon.