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The Big File All issues not easily categorized in the above forums are here. Comments on general health, diet, "getting comfortable," and more are here.


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  #1  
Old 12-12-2008, 08:18 AM
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trkdoc714 trkdoc714 is offline
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Default Sleep Issues

I've noticed a lot of people are nocturnal on this forum. Are you experiencing the same sleep issues I do?

I can get comfortable enough to sleep for 1 to 1 1/2 hours at a time but I wake frequently due to pain or effects of the pain meds. I'll do this during the week and "catch up" on the weekends when I can take heavier doses of Oxycodone for pain relief.

I've tried AmbienCR. It makes me do odd things in the middle of the night and has a depressant quality to it that affects my work the next day.

We bought a Tempurpedic mattress that's pretty comfortable but the comfort only lasts until I change positions while I sleep.

Does anyone have some "best practices" I can try?

Bob
__________________
04/06 L5/S1 Rupture
05/06 MRI shows DDD @ L2-S1
06/06 Diskectomy/ Laminotomy L5/S1
04/07 Recurrent Disc L5/S1
4 Ortho and 1 Neuro Surgeon, 5 MRIs, 1 EGM, 1 Myleogram & 11 EDIs later:
03/27/09 L4/5 & L5/S1 Maverick disc at Stenum
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  #2  
Old 12-12-2008, 04:08 PM
Adrienne Adrienne is offline
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Hi Bob,

Try taking the short acting Ambien, without the CR. I've been known to split a pill in half, taking a half at bedtime and the other half in the middle of the night should I wake up and not be able to get back to sleep.

It has a short half life of about 3 hours so it might be easier to gauge your dose according to need. You still might do odd things in the night but your days should be better.

Adrienne
__________________
Minimal DDD L4/L5
Minimal DDD L5/S1
Disco 4/07 : Large tear: @L5/S1
Idet 4/08 No improvement
Now looking at ADR vs. Fusion
ALIF Fusion 2/10 Stanford
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  #3  
Old 12-14-2008, 12:33 PM
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trkdoc714 trkdoc714 is offline
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Default Ambien

Thanks for the idea Adrienne. My pharmacist pointed me toward a non prescription sleep aid that gave me a better nights rest.

I really don't want to go back to any form of Ambien. I have a great fear of having the police called at 2 AM while I"m in the front yard belting out Julie Andrews show tunes while dressed in my pajamas.

I just can't carry a tune.....

Bob
__________________
04/06 L5/S1 Rupture
05/06 MRI shows DDD @ L2-S1
06/06 Diskectomy/ Laminotomy L5/S1
04/07 Recurrent Disc L5/S1
4 Ortho and 1 Neuro Surgeon, 5 MRIs, 1 EGM, 1 Myleogram & 11 EDIs later:
03/27/09 L4/5 & L5/S1 Maverick disc at Stenum
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  #4  
Old 12-14-2008, 01:58 PM
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Terry Terry is offline
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Bob has a fabulous sense of humor and is a wonderful addition to the forum.

I always laugh when I read his posts.

I got a good mental image of the police arriving at his house at 2:00 AM

Welcome to the forum Bob, and may your holidays be blessed.

Terry Newton
__________________
1980 ruptured L4-L5
1988 ruptured SI-L5
1990 ruptured C5-C6
1994 ruptured C6-C7
1995 Hemi-Laminectomy C5-C6, C6-C7 Mayo Clinic
Bicycle Accident 2004
MRI, EMG, Facet Injections, Epidural Blocks, Lumbar Discogram.
Stenum Hospital Surgery November 4, 2006
Prestige Disc C5-C6, C6-C7
Maverick Disc S1-L5, L4-L5
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  #5  
Old 12-14-2008, 09:43 PM
Justin Justin is offline
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Bob,

I'll second what Terry said! That was hilarious. I used to be on Ambien... good times, good times.

EDIT: Here's some tips on sleep hygiene --> Click Here -- Tips on Sleep Hygiene If you can believe it, we actually learned all of this in our psychiatry course. A lot of it seems so elementary, but these changes in behavior really do work.

Last edited by Justin; 12-14-2008 at 09:56 PM.
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  #6  
Old 12-15-2008, 02:16 AM
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KBear KBear is offline
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Talking

Damn.. why can't crazy stuff like that happen in my neighborhood at 2am, cause I am definitely up! Maybe I should slip some ambien into my hubby's tea
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  #7  
Old 12-15-2008, 03:59 PM
LBP LBP is offline
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Default sleeping

Well I had a huge sleeping problem for about a year. I would be up til 4 -5 - 6 am. It was horrible.

I have a cocktail of meds to take at night and almost always helps.
1) Ambien CR
2) muscle relaxor (cyclobenzaprine)
3) Neurontin
4) Vicodin

Ambien CR made a huge difference over reg ambien. But I have to take these meds early enough at night, like 6 or 7 pm depending on how early you need to be up.

The muscle relaxor makes me sleepy too, so it helps to "knock me out" I only take it at night with the Ambien CR.

Is there a pain med or muscle relaxor that makes you sleepy? It might be a trial and error thing you have to work through with your dr. There are certains meds in the past that drs have tried on me and also made me really sleepy like Darvocet, Amitriptyline (Elavil).

Maybe there is some combination that will help you. It may just take more than one to do the trick.

I am now trying Rolfing (Structural Integration) and it's fascinating. After 7 years of chronic pain, I am finding out that my entire body is messed up, stressed, tight and painful. I am hoping to gain some relief from this technique which I am hoping will help me reduce my medication intake and make me more comfortable to fall asleep. I am also seeing my surgeon tomorrow to see if he recommends some injections for inflammatory relief.
__________________
Injured 9/01
Annular tears L4/5 & L5/S1
denied adr by insurance for 2 level charite as well as hybrid fusion at L5/S1 with Charite at L4/5.

New ins paid for 2 level lumbar prodisc surgery on 4/7/08 (at age 39) with Dr. Westerlund, at Core Orthop
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  #8  
Old 12-15-2008, 04:18 PM
mango
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Default Rolfing

LBP
I am in my fifth rolfing session and my body is a mess,Things have improved and some things have gotten different! Each session has reactions to my body good and bad? let me know how it works for you?
Yes it does hurt but just for the session.
good Luck
Gil
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  #9  
Old 12-15-2008, 06:04 PM
Liz Liz is offline
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Default insomnia and rolfing

great topic... i have struggled w/insomnia since my early 20s. in addition to my pain and discomfort i have trouble turning off my analytical brain to sleep.

like LBP usually Ambien (CR or regular 10mg) and Neurontin (600mg) work well for me (along w/a little vino) and i don't experience any side effects in the AM. the past week, however, has been rough and i've hardly slept at all. i don't get angry when i don't sleep, i just get looooney. of course our bodies can't heal if we aren't sleeping. i've experimented with muscle relaxers and other sleeping meds but no dice. last night i took an Ativan which allowed me to sleep for 6 hrs but i don't want to get in the habit of taking it b/c it's addictive.

sometimes epsom salt baths w/lavender help me sleep. i've also tried teas and the natural supplements like Valerian and Melatonin. I may try 5HTP but i believe it interacts w/some meds.

interesting y'all mention rolfing... i hope it gives you both relief. it's intense! i had two sessions pre-op but couldn't tolerate it w/all i had going on in my body. my osteopath thinks it's too aggressive for me and that it may make my spine worse (and more unstable), but i'm debating giving it a whirl with an experienced rolfer. i wish it wasn't so expensive. the approach makes sense to me and i know people that have benefitted from it.

keep us posted how you are doing with it.

liz
__________________
scoliosis; 1998 snowboarding injury->DDD L3-S1 w/annular tears/protrusions; 2007 episodes of rt foot drop
2007 Prodisc ADR L4-S1
L4-5 Prodisc tilted/facet issues; old L5 nerve damage
2009 L4-5 Prodisc ADR removed and revised to XLIF w/posterior instrumentation
massive hemorrhage from tear of inferior vena cava at right iliac vein due to adhesion from Prodisc op
2010 not fused; as a result of complications permanent nerve damage to lumbar plexus causing severe rt leg, hip, groin pain

Last edited by Liz; 12-15-2008 at 06:08 PM.
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  #10  
Old 12-15-2008, 09:01 PM
LBP LBP is offline
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Default rolfing

Well I didn't know anything about rolfing...what a horrible name but I met a guy who claims he was facing multi level fusion or ADR after a car/bike accident and found rolfing...which helped him avoid surgery and now is very physically active.

After having lots of good PT and massage experiences, I do feel like rolfing has something new to offer. My IT band, especially left side is very tender and painful to touch, super tight. I couldn't tollerate his first approach to stretching out that fascia but I could tollerate it when he tried a different approach. My legs (IT/quads), back of head/neck, armpits, peck muscles were on fire the night after my first session... in a way I knew he was hitting some areas that really needed work. Not dangerous kind of pain but the kind of pain you know in the long run is productive.

I have my second session this week. This stuff should be included in a comprehensive insurance plan for people with chronic pain. Massage, PT, rolfing, accupuncture, whatever it takes to be productive again!

This is related to this sleeping topic because pre injury I was a stomach sleeper..I have not been able to sleep on my stomach since injury...makes my legs go numb. And I cannot sleep on back because my butt and hips need relief, so I sleep on my side, alternating back and forth which I've noticed has put a lot of pressure on my shoulders and I have had more recent problems with a tingling in my pinky fingers as a result. IN rolfing, I'm discovering that my shoulders have really rolled forward and tightened up in a way I don't think existed before I was injured and had all these sleeping problems. It is a big "hot spot" where the nerves flow from neck to arm via shoulder/front part of armpit.
__________________
Injured 9/01
Annular tears L4/5 & L5/S1
denied adr by insurance for 2 level charite as well as hybrid fusion at L5/S1 with Charite at L4/5.

New ins paid for 2 level lumbar prodisc surgery on 4/7/08 (at age 39) with Dr. Westerlund, at Core Orthop

Last edited by LBP; 12-15-2008 at 09:05 PM.
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