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  #1  
Old 05-19-2017, 02:50 PM
RabidJ RabidJ is offline
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Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 34
Default My story L4L5 disc problems....

Hello everybody, I appreciate this forum since I have been able to gather quite a bit of information to help me make a good decision.

I am a happily married faithful man with two children ages 5 and 3. It is for my family above all that I look to improve my back pain situation. So again, thank all of you for your stories and information. I am looking to document my story for anybody who may be helped by it.

I am 36 years old and have had back pain for about 18 years now. I am not exactly sure where all of my pain started but I believe that it could have started from a high school football game during my senior year. My “pain” did not really start off as pain but more like a certain type of discomfort in my back. As a very young man at the time, I didn’t think anything of it and figured it would just go away. It never really did go away.

Although the discomfort never went away, it still never kept me from living a very active lifestyle. In fact, shortly after I graduated from high school, I enlisted into the U.S. Army. I have no regrets for serving my country and feel very proud to have done so but while I served, I put my body through a lot physically. I served in the Middle East, went to airborne school, air assault school, IOBC, etc.

I have had several “episodes” through the years where I have been put out of commission because of my back. Back in 2011, I had enough and decided that I need to pursue some sort of procedure to relieve my pain. I had to take a whole lot of time off of work and ended up getting a discectomy in February of 2012 by Dr. Anthony Yeung in Phoenix, AZ. I do not recommend anybody see this doctor. His bedside manner is terrible and I’m not so sure that he is a good surgeon since I didn’t do as much research at the time as I should have. Of course, at the time, I was desperate. My sciatica did subside after the procedure but another pain on my right side (hip/butt area) surfaced after the procedure.

I was able to manage this pain for the last 5 years until this last January. For some reason, my pain mounted to the point where I was having trouble getting out of bed. Walking has also been a problem although when the “wheels feel greased” I can get around a little better. Mornings, evenings, and nights are most difficult.

I will attach my MRI report from the Veterans Affairs. I am suspicious that maybe the report does not report all of the symptoms of my back since I question the competency of the VA. Also, the VA gave me a cd with my MRI images on them but I do not know how to download the images to my computer.

With all of that said, I have begun to look for what could be a possible solution for me. At this point, I do not know if I’m even a candidate for ADR but would prefer this vs fusion. I will be seeing a Veterans Affairs surgeon on May 31st for information purposes only since there is no way I would let him operate on my back. I expect that he will want to give me shots in my back or prescribe me pain medications. I will report back on this.
I have also reached out to Dr. Rischke in Switzerland via email and will be seeing him at some point in the near future since I will be moving to Europe for at least a year to be with my wife’s family in France.

The two discs that seem to be the best based on testimonies are the LP-ESP and the Axiom Freedom disc. M6 scares me because of some testimonies and ball-and-socket discs make no sense to me since our back doesn’t work this way. Does anybody on this forum know who does the Freedom Lumbar disc? I know the Jamaican Doctor, Kingsley Chin, does it but does anybody know of doctors in Europe that do it? I believe Dr. Rischke used to do it but I think he now uses the LP-ESP.
__________________
-18 Years of some level of back pain
-Discectomy at L4L5 in February 2012
-DDD at L4L5 L5S1
-Two-level lumbar ADR L4L5 L5S1 by Dr. Desai November 2017

Last edited by RabidJ; 05-20-2017 at 11:21 AM.
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  #2  
Old 05-19-2017, 03:04 PM
RabidJ RabidJ is offline
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Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 34
Default

Attached is my MRI report.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf MRI_Report.pdf (169.8 KB, 110 views)
__________________
-18 Years of some level of back pain
-Discectomy at L4L5 in February 2012
-DDD at L4L5 L5S1
-Two-level lumbar ADR L4L5 L5S1 by Dr. Desai November 2017
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  #3  
Old 05-19-2017, 04:11 PM
perepere8 perepere8 is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 16
Default

Why not m6? Actualy alot of people goes more with m6 disc then any another...
__________________
Back pain since 16 year old, im 31 now.
DDD L3 L4, positive discogram at that level. Concordant pain.
28.02.2012 Selective endoscopic discectomy with thermal annuloplasty. No relief at all.
Considering ADR at that level
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  #4  
Old 05-21-2017, 12:27 PM
RabidJ RabidJ is offline
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Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 34
Default Attached is an M6

Look at the attached. This is an M6.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 17862696_883356138470740_8639967576550184705_n.jpg (102.0 KB, 110 views)
__________________
-18 Years of some level of back pain
-Discectomy at L4L5 in February 2012
-DDD at L4L5 L5S1
-Two-level lumbar ADR L4L5 L5S1 by Dr. Desai November 2017
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  #5  
Old 05-21-2017, 01:37 PM
LHerm LHerm is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 22
Default

I haven't had as long duration of pain as you have but understand your situation and disc questioning. I had the same selective endoscopic discectomy as you but by another surgeon. It was a bandaid and still glad l did it. It's been a year and I haven't returned to activity that l like - mountain biking, skiing, backpacking, running, and weight lifting.

I've rresearched all the discs. Each manufacturer makes different sizes. Some make several sizes like ActivL and M6. Others only make one size that may be too small for your supporting L5 vertebrae. That's the case with me. I'd love to get the LP-ESP but it's too small. My choice for x-large is choosing between ActivL or M6. I understand your reservation for either. M6 inner disc is only 25 mm which causes problems like the image you showed. It's 25 mm regardless the size of end plates.

Launch your CD and measure the width and length of your L5 vertebrae. Let us know in cm or mm. The size may eliminate some choices. Dr. Rische prefers LP ESP over Freedom. Though he was an investigator of the Freedom disk. The end plates don't bond well to the bone. He's had to remove several Freedom discs after several months with zero bone bonding. That's unacceptable.


Another choice for LP-ESP is Dr. BIREN DESAI in Germany. Total package cost including everything but travel is US $15,800. I would not hesitate going with him. Too bad my vertebra is too large fir this disc.Send a CD to him with your email contact, description of your current pain, and activities and he'll email you after he's reviews your mailed info.
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  #6  
Old 05-21-2017, 09:10 PM
Harrison's Avatar
Harrison Harrison is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,010
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RJ,

The MRI report notes reactive changes in the endplate, possibly suggesting a more acute inflammatory process. IMHO, you need to work very hard to rule out infection, which is surprisingly common in back pain patients. Pls see this article and read a few times:

http://www.ajnr.org/content/29/5/838

Also see this relevant topic:

https://www.adrsupport.org/forums/sh...ower+back+pain

PS: I emailed you yesterday too.
__________________
"Harrison" - info (at) adrsupport.org
Fell on my ***winter 2003, Canceled fusion April 6 2004
Reborn June 25th, 2004, L5-S1 ADR Charite in Boston
Founder & moderator of ADRSupport - 2004
Founder Arthroplasty Patient Foundation a 501(c)(3) - 2006
Creator & producer, Why Am I Still Sick? - 2012
Donate www.arthropatient.org/about/donate
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  #7  
Old 05-29-2017, 05:40 PM
bfdfix bfdfix is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2017
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RabidJ View Post
Look at the attached. This is an M6.

That disc was incorrectly installed not a failure because of the actual disc (I will most likely gow tih the LP ESP by the way not m6, I just wanted to point out the problem in that mri is the surgeon not the disc)
__________________
2013 - Back damaged deadlifting in the gym, recovered well and never had sciatica but life was always a little harder after this injury.

08.16 - Back/sciatica problems arose (what I class as the start of life changing problems in day to day life)

10.16 - After signifcant recovery problems arose again and life has never been the same since

02.17 - L4/5 Small bulge, L5/S1 small protrusion confirmed by MRI, L5/S1 pressed on sciatic nerve but no significant compression noted.
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  #8  
Old 06-03-2017, 10:03 PM
GKTM300 GKTM300 is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 273
Default M6

I was shown over 100 failed m6 disc X-rays and actual photos of the failed disc as seen on approach. I believe the more I learn about the ball n socket design the more I like it.
__________________
12/22/04 blew L4-5 and L5-S1 out lifting wrong
4/1/05 back to work thanks to Oxy
11/11/13 hurt back lifting again
6/6/15 last of many MRI L4-5 medium paracentral bulge with juice leaking and mid to left bulge on L5-S1
No invasive procedures except steroid shots that did nothing n hurt wicked bad
9/24/2016 Adr surgery Bertagnoli>1 year doing great
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  #9  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:00 AM
RabidJ RabidJ is offline
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Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 34
Default

Hello everybody, I apologize for taking so long to get back on the forum. I have been working on moving me and my family to Montpellier, France and arrived just a week ago.

I am going to start seeing Doctors here in France to see if the doctors can come to a consensus about what my problem is and what approach is best.

Just before I left the U.S., I saw a VA Doctor in Albuquerque who was a pretty nice guy but didn't really know anything about ADR. The visit was somewhat of a waste of time. I was hoping to get some information from him before I left.

Side note: Veterans are medically covered overseas for any service-connected disabilities. The program is called the VA Foreign Medical Program. If you are overseas for whatever reason and need to be covered, call this number: 303-331-7590

The first Dr that I will be seeing is Dr Gregory Dran. I will see him this Thursday. I am curious to see if he offers LP-ESP and what he thinks about ADR. I'll keep everybody posted.

Dr Thierry Marnay is another doctor that I would like to see here in Montpellier. He performs the Pro-Disc, which I'm not interested in, although I would like to hear him out.

The next Dr on my list to see is a Dr in Paris although this is going to take a little more planning because Jean-Yves Lazennec is in Paris. I am certain that he does the LP-ESP. It may be a little while before I can visit him.

Also, I have been in contact with Dr Rischke in Switzerland and just sent him my MRI. He is currently on vacation so it will be a little while before he gets back to me.

I also sent an email to France Rachis to get information on all of the Doctors here in France that use the LP-ESP........
__________________
-18 Years of some level of back pain
-Discectomy at L4L5 in February 2012
-DDD at L4L5 L5S1
-Two-level lumbar ADR L4L5 L5S1 by Dr. Desai November 2017
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  #10  
Old 07-24-2017, 11:34 AM
LHerm LHerm is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 22
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I'm in the process of scheduling an L4-5 LP-ESP from Dr. Desai in Germany.
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